The stats he gave me are <1 dying from unvaccinated reinfections. In fact it was Zero as of his last post.
Quick Update: Gulf Coast COVID numbers
- Thread starter mrhickory
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Pay attention to what @vanceme says in this thread (after this post). He had covid and got really close to dying (hospital for a month I believe around last Christmas). He was depending on his antibodies until a few weeks ago (based on his post on the last couple or three pages).
He had a reason for changing his mind. If I were in your shoes, I’d be very interested to hear why he changed his mind. (At least based on what I understand to be his position and your position…..which is why I’m specifically mentioning it to you as.)
Apologies if I’m misremembering, but really don’t think I am. (And no dog in this fight/personal decision obviously.)
Its not about comparing the diseases. It’s a comparison of how much we are focused on combating one potential cause of death, to the general lack of interest we have in mitigating heart disease—our leading cause of death. Which is even more interesting given that a high percentage of Covid deaths are strongly linked to having comorbidities that are most commonly the result of doing little to improve cardiovascular health.
This was one of ours from down here that passed last night. Healthy, young, unvaccinated male LEO with no comorbid conditions. Alpha was taking out the older with comorbid conditions, delta is different. Went from working on Friday to having passed 6 days later. We don’t know why it is affecting younger healthier people. With how our ICU’s look, we will have many of these stories. We have delivered three different women who are now on vent in their 20’s-30’s. They will likely never meet that child or see their other children again. They are now in the well-known declining steps that we see with patients that make it to this point.
Hopefully this scale of disaster doesn’t make it to your area of the woods. But we are just down the road from most of you.
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There is a nasty strain of RSV that has been going around right now along with COVID. About 15-20 years ago, my wife and I picked up RSV from the kids and it was like the worst cold ever and wouldn’t go away. They say this one out there now is particularly nasty, with worse symptoms than COVID for most folks. If y’all are negative for COVID, maybe that is what has hit you. Whatever it is, I hope you and your fam get back to 100% soon.
If you have concerns about the vaccines and you and your family have already had COVID, you don’t “need” to get vaccinated. Getting one dose might give you a bit more immunity, but your risk of hospitalization or death is much, much lower than for people who haven’t had it and who also haven’t been vaxxed. Some of the more rabid supporters of vaccination don’t like to talk about it, but those with natural immunity are not filling up the hospitals. Reinfections do occur, but are somewhat similar in likelihood to breakthroughs. Reinfection is not the problem, at least not right now.
I would agree with this to a large extent. However, I would be vigilant about checking antibody titers every 3-6 months as that this immunity wanes over time. Also, the more severe the first infection usually yields higher antibody titers.
Have good friends that live in Panama City ... similar deal. They contracted COVID in Nov 2020 ... went and were tested for antibody levels in late July and antibodies were gone. That's 6-7 months. Granted, that is just their experience. I know it differs.
They were very apprehensive about vaccines ... but both opted to get J&J.
Before this latest surge you were as likely to get hit by lightning as to get reinfected with COVID. I had said all along I would get the vaccine if people started getting reinfected. I got the Moderna shot two weeks ago and as I was told would happen it put me to bed for three days (Really bad body aches and chills). I felt worse than when I had COVID. This is a known issue for folks who have had COVID and get the vaccine. It sucks but I don't want COVID again and with delta people were starting to get it again. So I went and got my shot. Does that explain it?
Given that 42% of the US population is obese this kind makes since. Older people are even more likely to be obese. Not sure it is fat that is the issue. Its when you are fat and have other issues as well. Most people just assume fat people have other issues.
Wrong. I showed you a study months ago with 330 reinfection. You ignored it. I’m glad you got vaccinated.
Death is also not the only bad outcome. I have a few of my long term patients who are jacked up for life due to stroke, pulmonary scarring, PE, etc.
@jeffgilmer I would have 100% agreed with you until about two weeks ago when the data from the delta variant came in. It showed that you were just as likely to get reinfection from the delta variant as someone who had been vaccinated (Previously that wasn't the case). They also rans some tests and showed that if you have had COVID and then you go get the vaccine that you are way less likely to get it again. As in they are not seeing I had COVID and I am vaccinated showing up. I don't want COVID again so I went and got the vaccine. I will say I believe that in time we will all have to get the vaccine. It will be required for works or to just enjoy life (Concerts, travel, sports events, etc). So I went and got it. Both my boys are also getting it. With delta it was time. So you do you but the data says it is time to get supercharged against COVID.
This is the best video I have seen on the issue:
Agreed but the anti-vax crowd doesn’t even consider morbidity…only mortality. There is a whole lot of fingers in ears singing “la la la” regarding this (less here than bookface). It’s very real and serious.
But, we (LA and MS) are literally on the verge of being a new Italy or New York and it doesn’t even make some news channels.
Oh wow, you’re a really tough guy. I’ll make a note that I shouldn’t mess with you. What does it feel like to be such a big, strong alpha male? Care to share some calf pics?
I've been encouraging as many as I can, to take the time to get tested for antibodies, (especially those who THINK they had COVID, but wasn't officially diagnosed). In addition, for really high risk folks in my family, (e.g. both my parents), I've encouraged them to get tested for antibodies 2-3 months after they were vaccinated too.
At present, I'm getting mine checked every 6 months. Do you think having it checked every 3 months, (i.e. the lower side of the range you gave), be better? I thought that 6 months would be a good initial interval, (and I'm busy as HECK, so less is better if possible).
We are there now in our part of the Wiregrass. Your system is a precursor for the rest of us. Seems to really be drastically affecting alot of young otherwise healthy OB patients in our small hospital as well.
This was one of ours from down here that passed last night. Healthy, young, unvaccinated male LEO with no comorbid conditions. Alpha was taking out the older with comorbid conditions, delta is different. Went from working on Friday to having passed 6 days later. We don’t know why it is affecting younger healthier people. With how our ICU’s look, we will have many of these stories. We have delivered three different women who are now on vent in their 20’s-30’s. They will likely never meet that child or see their other children again. They are now in the well-known declining steps that we see with patients that make it to this point.
Hopefully this scale of disaster doesn’t make it to your area of the woods. But we are just down the road from most of you.
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If I may offer a plausible explanation, we are only as healthy as our immune response. Younger people's more robust immune system was able to overcome the effects of the Alpha strain. The Delta strain creates so much more of a viral load that even the younger, more robust immune systems can not keep up. It's simply overwhelms the reducing capacity. Since they can not negate the electrical charge caused by the virus, oxidative stress is increased and cellular damage occurs.
So, your friends had COVID less than a year ago, AND got vaccinated, and they have NO antibodies??? I'd have them go to another lab to verify those results. That's super weird and highly Sus IMHO.
I've seen reports of some labs being so busy, that they've just chunked some tests. Hope something similar didn't happen to your friends. One lab forgot to send in my daughter's blood work, and when she called to follow up 2 weeks later as to why she didn't have any results, they were at least honest enough to have her come back in instead of falsifying the results.
My God. You don’t even understand that the cdc and vaers aren’t saying any of those are connected to the vaccines. Come on. Be smarter.
No. Read his post again. They got vaccinated after seeing no antibodies. Also, antibodies helps the most on not getting infected but the backup system of T and B cells offer the real longer lasting protection from severe disease. If healthy people get boosters in the next 6 months, they are getting it to just avoid any infection whatsoever as efficacy is still 88% against symptomatic Covid and higher for death and severe disease. I’m pro-mRNA but I’m not getting a booster just to avoid Covid with no to little symptoms.
The only way we will be able to beat this is to have every animal and person vaccinated multiple times a week with an effective vaccine. Otherwise it’s now just part of life. Your vaccine or natural antibodies from previous infection aren’t going to do shit to save you.
Lol. Vaccines will last for years vs severe disease and death. I can only guess you’re a troll.
If I had to go get the vaccine today, I would get Moderna. Which one did you get? What are your boys getting? Are you just getting one shot or two?
Tough guy? Don't think I've been accused of that before. My calves are pretty decent though actually. I would post a pic, but I'm an oulde and there are too many steps to post a fricken pic on this site. So, sorry about that!
I am fully on board with getting vaccinated. I encourage people to do it. I’m just not a dumbass who thinks the vaccine will do anything to prevent infection (delta has proven that it hardly does this). Once infected, the vaccine is really worthless.
1) While J&J and Pfizer have admittedly not be STRONG against preventing infection, we are still looking at maybe 40-60% efficacy. And Moderna has proven to be very resilient against Delta.
2) Once infect, the vaccine actually may provide the MOST benefit as it makes symptoms milder and has proven really effective in preventing hospitalization and death. So I wouldn't call that "worthless."
People that get COVID have little to no symptoms some 80% of the time. 5-10% of the time they get severe disease. 1% or so die.
I have serious doubts the vaccine has any affect whatsoever on that.
Please don’t take this as being anti-vax. I am shot up and I think it’s a good idea to do it. I just don’t think it does shit.
Ditto. I have no intentions of getting another shot unless there is some really, really strong evidence for why it is needed. Maybe for very old folks or for those with weak/compromised immune systems it makes sense, but I see no reason for it yet for most of us.
I would add j&j recepients. I would get one if I’m them. I would say in order 1) immunity problem people, 2) those over 60 like Israel, 3) healthcare workers since they are exposed more and see sick people. We also don’t need them out with an infection.
Well, I'm talking about infected vaccinated vs. infected unvaccinated. I guess it COULD be a massive coincidence, but the infected unvaccinated end up in the hospital at overwhelming larger rates than the infected vaccinated. If you look at hospitalization stats, you also see something like 90-95% in ICU are unvaccinated, and considering America is pretty much 50/50 right now in terms of vaccinated vs. not, I think that gives a pretty good picture. Glad you aren't anti-vax. That's the important part. We can disagree and quibble over other stuff. But I do think you've got a lot more protection, even if infected, than you would otherwise.
Well, they do that for a reason - because it's the unvaccinated fueling this surge and putting us back to where we were back in January all over again.
Yes the vaccinated are getting the delta variant more than they were the previous mutations, but it's still overwhelmingly a surge of the unvaccinated. That's for a couple of reasons. First, the vaccinated are just far less likely to get infected in the first place. But even for those that do have a breakthrough infection, the viral loads they see in them are just as high as unvaccinated people early on, but quickly drops (within 5 days) while the viral loads in unvaccinated people persists. The reason for that is, the type of response the COVID vaccine produces in a person means that they have antibodies circulating around in high numbers in the bloodstream. The virus doesn't have long to replicate before those antibodies start attacking it and reducing the load before the person gets very ill or spreads it to a lot of people.
The way this doctor explains it, it's akin to someone trying to break into a house. While the vaccines don't 100% prevent the would-be burglar from getting on the property and opening the door, it's like the homeowner is armed with a bat on the other side of the door and when the guy gets in, starts beating the intruder up. The unvaccinated person is more like a home where no one's at home and the intruder virtually has free rein to ransack and steal.
What we now know about how to fight the delta variant of COVID | Column
An expert explains why vaccines — and masks — are so important, and why delta is different and more dangerous.
Look, our God-given immune systems are amazing and for most stuff they work great all on their own. But God also gave us medical knowledge, scientific advancement, men and women who study for years and dedicate their lives to understanding disease-causing pathogens and how to help our immune systems combat them, and the ability to produce treatments to alleviate symptoms and/or vaccines to help prevent them from doing serious damage to us. We should receive these wonderful advancements with thanksgiving just as freely and willingly as we receive and are thankful for the immune systems we're born with.
As has been said before, I trust God when I'm driving, but I still wear a seatbelt and buy cars with better safety features and crash test ratings. I trust God out on the lake in a boat, but I still have enough life vests for everyone on my boat. I trust God, but still have a security system, smoke detectors and lock my house at night. I trust God, but still take my prescribed medicines. It's a false dichotomy to pit trusting God with your immune system vs trusting in vaccines or other treatments. The things aren't mutually exclusive. Medical science and faith are not opposed to one another.
Whenever there's a booster intended for those who've been vaccinated already that's coded to account for the variants that have emerged, I'll go get it. But I'm not sure I see much point for most vaccinated people getting just another dose of the same thing they already got - unless they are immunocompromised people already.
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