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But where is the outrage. It’s thousands of deaths we should be trying to save not the tiny fraction caused by copsi've said quite a few times ITT that there are a multitude of reasons why black on black crime is an issue...and you have completely ignored that thought process so really you DGAF about black on black crime other than to use it as a statistic to fit your narrative
I think he's saying since black on black crime is high, Then all blacks deserve to be killed, whether they commit or crime or not
But where is the outrage. It’s thousands of deaths we should be trying to save not the tiny fraction caused by cops
You are much too old to be one of my kids but I tell them the best way to start is from within. Your actions and decisions make a ripple movement outward. One suggestion I try to make to my kids is these or our communities. Not black communities, white communities, Asian communities etc. It is hard for anybody to have empathy for you if you do not consider them part of your community. We discuss too much about races and not enough about people.And that's why its so disheartening. You're coming from an honest place and it's obvious from your posts. Just a really tough bunch to get across to on this subject. Always has been.
Not at all, this type of crap is not helpful in any shape or form. This is just as bad as those that paint all cops as racists..stop it.I think he's saying since black on black crime is high, Then all blacks deserve to be killed, whether they commit a crime or not
If I’m reading correctly, you’re saying that for systemic racism to exist, it has to be written down in definable rules that single out minorities.If I am reading correctly you say that since people of color have bad experiences with cops is it is because of race. You may be right but again it is poor decisions by the individual and not the system. I just have not found many rules that single out minorities for punishment.
Have proper accountability, which is systematic in government, and that goes away I believe. The thing is that they just are not doing a good job of defining what a cop is supposed to do. My kids have a poor opinion of LEO but think all four of our DARE officers are great until they are in trouble. Hell they called our two black officers racist for taking them out of a teachers class when there are no white people in the class. It is just ingrained in them to believe the only possible reason they are singled out is racism.
Not at all, this type of crap is not helpful in any shape or form. This is just as bad as those that paint all cops as racists..stop it.
How is it deflection when police are mostly present for those crimes, which is the discussion at hand? I'm really trying to be civil and understand what you're trying to say, you're just leaving off major variables/common sense in this discussion here."but blacks kill other blacks" is a deflection for people who refuse to open their mind to the bigger picture.
everyone knows black on black crime is a major issue. healing societal and racial inequities would help with that but that's too much to put on some people's brains. merely seeking an understanding so we can find a way to fix things = just making excuses to the obtuse
How is it deflection when police are mostly present for those crimes, which is the discussion at hand? I'm really trying to be civil and understand what you're trying to say, you're just leaving off major variables/common sense in this discussion here.
What is either side, I don't want anyone to die...I would love for their to be peace in this world but as I've said 10 times now, evil doesn't have a badge or a skin color. You're accusing me of not close minded, but you're not looking at how complex this issue is and just looking at "cops kill blacks at a high rate therefore all cops are bad".he is describing you ITT! jesus
you are not helpful to either side
What is your solution. I believe cops need to be tougher, prison needs to be harsher, sentences longer. We need to bulldoze all abandoned buildings. Graffiti and trash need to be cleaned. Parents not sending kids to school should be punished. Kids not on track to graduate should be sent to special schools. No one Over 19 should be in ph Lux school. I have ideas that are actionable. Not just let’s all hug"but blacks kill other blacks" is a deflection for people who refuse to open their mind to the bigger picture.
everyone knows black on black crime is a major issue. healing societal and racial inequities would help with that but that's too much to put on some people's brains. merely seeking an understanding so we can find a way to fix things = just making excuses to the obtuse
I amyou are not trying to understand a damn thing
Um, unlike you I've actually done ride alongs with MPD, multiple times(and have had talks with my cousin that is a lieutenant for Miami Dade police Dept) , I also have had discussions about this over the years with many of my fellow black coworkers and friends as to how they are treated by police, I understand a lot more than you think I do...you're just throwing rocks in a pond on the internet.you are not trying to understand a damn thing
I do not take offense at people saying what they think I said because they are not lying. It just may not be what I intended to get across. I am a numbers guy so systemic means it has to be a pattern that holds all the time.If I’m reading correctly, you’re saying that for systemic racism to exist, it has to be written down in definable rules that single out minorities.
Bottom line, we disagree. That has been established for a while. I’m not interested in trying to convince you you’re wrong and I can assure you you want convince me, I am.
I’m going to step away from this discussion at this point. I fear if we go much further, you will accuse me of being racist as you have in the past.
You have an excellent day.
Well, we were in an argument and you said, “you may be the most racist person I’ve encountered. You believe people should be treated differently because of their color”.I do not take offense at people saying what they think I said because they are not lying. It just may not be what I intended to get across. I am a numbers guy so systemic means it has to be a pattern that holds all the time.
Like the rules for solving an equation. It has to be a pattern that works in all situations. Kids will find something they think works because it fits that one situation but does not really work on all situations. This is important to me because I have to come up with solutions so a pattern must be found that gets a solution that works all the time.
This time 1000There is for sure racism, no one can deny that. Talking with my LEO friends, the problem is usually not RACE, it's about respect for authority. People that do not respect police officers get treated more poorly than people that do.
A lot of people, including Bunkerites, listen to rap music. Just pick any top-selling rap song at random and read the lyrics. Most of them involve killing someone, or bullying them with a gun. Millions of young people, of all colors, listen to this constantly. Someone with a father in their household and discipline in their life probably would not act out because of song lyrics. But kids without any direction are much more likely to.
A lot of people will roll their eyes, but glorifying murder in almost every song you listen to will many times lead to the exact behavior we are seeing today.
I actually think there has been some good discussion in this thread. Good job by all really.
I will say what I think the real issue is so everyone can thump me for it.
I am a white male and as you can imagine have been my entire life. I grew up poorish not really poor like some of the people I hung out with but not rich like some of the others either. We had food but things were always tight and we didn't get fancy cars, vacations, etc. We pretty much lived. Now when it came time for college I got an ROTC scholarship and went to school. I served in the Military and have made my own way in life.
My issue these days is that as a white male my voice is rarely ever heard. Everyone thinks I have been given everything in life. No one gives me credit for the hard work I put in and if I dare to suggest that others could put in hard work and get what they want I am a racist. So I look at what is going on now and once again I am told that my life doesn't matter only Black Lives Matter. I am told to even suggest that my life matters as well makes me a you guessed it racist.
Well I have lived my entire life being inclusive without regard to race. Guess what now I am a racist for being inclusive because I don't believe we should look at race.
So my opinion isnt desired, my voice on issues when given is ignored and my life isnt worth as much as others. Now I wonder why people feel left out of this movement? What if we had a movement on police brutality and said we wanted to be inclusive of all races and go after the brutality itself? OOh wait a minute, I know, its because that would be racist to include other races in the cause.
The issue is we are calling people that can help racist for existing and most folks don't like being called something they are not so they just move on and care a lot less. You want change then be inclusive of all people because segregating out one minority group and saying all others are wrong is the actual problem.
What is your solution. I believe cops need to be tougher, prison needs to be harsher, sentences longer. We need to bulldoze all abandoned buildings. Graffiti and trash need to be cleaned. Parents not sending kids to school should be punished. Kids not on track to graduate should be sent to special schools. No one Over 19 should be in ph Lux school. I have ideas that are actionable. Not just let’s all hug
This is wonderful and I agree, for the average white citizen in the US, like both of us, we absolutely need to further understand the struggle blacks in this country have to deal with...but a police officer doesn't GAF about how hard a person's life if/when they are called into a scene and make the decision to use force.my solution would start with more white people understanding the plight of black people in this country
we all start day 1 the same...but there are factors at play that have led us to the disproportionate crime rates we see...if we eliminate the factors we can control it would be a major step in the right direction. there will always be bad apples but let's give everyone a fair shake from day 1
doing that will take lots of cleanup though...decades of creating obstacles for success for black people has snowballed into the skewed crime statistics we see today...statistics that can't be argued but can be fixed
do not come back at me with an anecdote about how hard life was for certain whites b/c i don't think all whites have it easy. white people face all kinds of struggles, but i can go very in depth about how those struggles are different and easier to overcome than they are for black people as a whole.
There was no intent because I doubt you would ever treat someone differently based solely on race.Well, we were in an argument and you said, “you may be the most racist person I’ve encountered. You believe people should be treated differently because of their color”.
I’m not sure, maybe I misinterpreted your intent.
Again, you have a great day!
I am not sure that is actually true. We have avenues for success but they might be difficult. The thing is we get these giant sweeping generalizations that just have no solution. It is like you are saying we want you to treat us differently because we are being blocked a path to success. Who is we, and who is you?my solution would start with more white people understanding the plight of black people in this country
we all start day 1 the same...but there are factors at play that have led us to the disproportionate crime rates we see...if we eliminate the factors we can control it would be a major step in the right direction. there will always be bad apples but let's give everyone a fair shake from day 1
doing that will take lots of cleanup though...decades of creating obstacles for success for black people has snowballed into the skewed crime statistics we see today...statistics that can't be argued but can be fixed
do not come back at me with an anecdote about how hard life was for certain whites b/c i don't think all whites have it easy. white people face all kinds of struggles, but i can go very in depth about how those struggles are different and easier to overcome than they are for black people as a whole.
All people have different struggles. Some are born with no arms , some are born in actual poor countries. No one in America is that poor. We are all responsible for ourselves. No person alive today can use excuses from yesterday. By allowing people to blame others you doom them forever. Personal responsibility is the answer.my solution would start with more white people understanding the plight of black people in this country
we all start day 1 the same...but there are factors at play that have led us to the disproportionate crime rates we see...if we eliminate the factors we can control it would be a major step in the right direction. there will always be bad apples but let's give everyone a fair shake from day 1
doing that will take lots of cleanup though...decades of creating obstacles for success for black people has snowballed into the skewed crime statistics we see today...statistics that can't be argued but can be fixed
do not come back at me with an anecdote about how hard life was for certain whites b/c i don't think all whites have it easy. white people face all kinds of struggles, but i can go very in depth about how those struggles are different and easier to overcome than they are for black people as a whole.
people have to quit saying "you just don't get it" when confronted with another viewpoint or a piece of data they cant explain......this is what happened to Drew Brees as well......Make and defend your point of view and refute the data if it is false....don't just say "you just don't get it" that does nothingyou are so far from understanding me b/c you don't have the willingness and you also don't have the capacity...so this is a pointless conversation
you are the epitome of a white dude who doesn't get it
I am not sure that is actually true. We have avenues for success but they might be difficult. The thing is we get these giant sweeping generalizations that just have no solution. It is like you are saying we want you to treat us differently because we are being blocked a path to success. Who is we, and who is you?
people have to quit saying "you just don't get it" when confronted with another viewpoint or a piece of data they cant explain......this is what happened to Drew Brees as well......Make and defend your point of view and refute the data if it is false....don't just say "you just don't get it" that does nothing
I protest systematic racism too. I have no personal experience with it, but I have no reason to deny it's existence.Just was trying to give an example. You are backing up what i said. There is systematic racism that is alive and well in this country. That is what is being protested. This country has come a long way, but has a long way to go.
I think most somewhat believe that but I am not sure. Many of the cops who are abusive have the same interaction with everybody. This cop that had complaints filed on him did not look like the type who cared what color someone was. He was just going to punish who ever did not comply quickly enough for him.i'm confused by your response sorry
i don't want people treated differently though...just the same.
Pure irony here...serious question, have you TRIED to understand this situation from the viewpoint of law enforcement? I have, many times. You seem very one sided in this discussion...i had to say it to rice b/c he was just putting words in my mouth and was refusing to even attempt to see my viewpoint
I think we do have mostly the same treatment from law enforcement. They are just more likely to get in a confrontation in poor neighborhoods than they do a rich neighborhood. Not race related it is community related.
Or having a family unit which includes a father. Who's "systemic fault is this?with alot of this happening in low income areas. This whole movement is about understanding that there are systemic things in place that make it more difficult for certain races to get out of poverty. If you are broke and need to eat bad enough you will steal it.
That’s untrue you just said you want me to see thing from the blacks point of view. That’s as racist as it get. I know you didn’t mean it that way. Those who use color as an excuse are not someone I would associate withi'm confused by your response sorry
i don't want people treated differently though...just the same.
Pure irony here...serious question, have you TRIED to understand this situation from the viewpoint of law enforcement? I have, many times.
So the answer to my question is no. Ok then. I guess we'll just agree to disagree. It's not a defense mechanism when you see things that officers go through on a nightly basis, even in non threatening situations.i don't have a single bad word to say about law enforcement and you can scan the entire thread if you'd like...that's your defense mechanism causing you to think i don't care about this situation through the lens of law enforcement. i happen to believe many of the things i have said would make life much easier on them.
i 100% support the police as i have already stated ITT
That’s untrue you just said you want me to see thing from the blacks point of view. That’s as racist as it get. I know you didn’t mean it that way. Those who use color as an excuse are not someone I would associate with
Have you ever been stationed over seas. I can promise you were you located would change your impression of a local community and put it on the whole country. Those things matter. So we want to try and make our communities more inclusive. Had some stupid ass announcer say I am from a black neighborhood that is fifty fifty. What no white people there. He is in a rich neighborhood that has nothing in common with the neighborhood Mr Floyd lived in.have you ever heard of red-lining?