in case anyone was wondering, Sweden did it right
- Thread starter T I G E R
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New Zealand did it right.
South Korea did it right.
South Korea did it right.
Jesus Christ. I wonder why they compared Sweden to the worst countries on Covid 19 besides the UK. Italy, Spain, UK and Belgium were the worst followed by Sweden then France then Utah.
So let’s go to the 3 immediate neighbors of Sweden.
Denmark: 104
Finland: 59
Norway: 45
Sweden: 500
Derp.
It's humorous people are still pointing to Sweden as a model when the architect of Sweden's "herd immunity response" has admitted it was a failure. He says they should have done more to avoid needless deaths. He also expected 40%of the population would have been infected and recovered by now, instead its only 6% while they have 5x the deaths of all the other nordic countries combined. The US and Sweden have had among the worst responses in the world and that's why neither have succeeded in reducing the spread of the virus. The US is in a drastically worse position than the EU as a whole because the patchwork of half-measures we took failed. We have had some our highest single day case totals in the last 2 days with over 30k+ reported.
Coronavirus: Sweden's Tegnell admits too many died
Sweden's controversial decision not to impose a strict lockdown in response to the Covid-19 pandemic led to too many deaths, the man behind the policy, Anders Tegnell, has acknowledged.
Sweden has seen a far higher mortality rate than its nearest neighbours and its nationals are being barred from crossing their borders.
Dr Tegnell told Swedish radio more should have been done early on.
"There is quite obviously a potential for improvement in what we have done."
Sweden has counted 4,542 deaths and 40,803 infections in a population of 10 million, while Denmark, Norway and Finland have imposed lockdowns and seen far lower rates.
Denmark has seen 580 deaths, Norway has had 237 deaths and Finland 321. Sweden reported a further 74 deaths on Wednesday.
Now he has told Swedish public radio: "If we were to encounter the same disease again, knowing exactly what we know about it today, I think we would settle on doing something in between what Sweden did and what the rest of the world has done."
Again numbers by themselves are meaningless.
I just listened to a report this morning that the USA economy will not be back to where it was until 2024 at the earliest.
This is more than just bad earnings. Real people will lose their jobs. Millions of Businesses will go out of business. Families will lose their homes.
How many lives are worth an entire country losing their economy?
It is easy for us to sit in ivory towers and compare Covid deaths per million when the fact is we don’t have a clue why some countries did well or why some states did well and others did awful.
If we knew we would all be doing it.
This virus will never go away and a vaccine is not 100% and we have no idea when or if will happen.
The original idea was to flatten the curve for hospitals and then we went overboard.
It is possible that Sweden did the best thing possible, taking EVERYTHING into consideration, we’ll never know.
Tiger, no offense, but that was an un-believably bad take. One of the worse ever on the Bunker, so that's saying something. Please read up on Sweden and re-assess your current position, as it's likely that you saw a quick tweet and just decided to trust it and/or didn't read enough other positions to form an objective and qualified opinion. It's possible that their approach might eventually turn out to be good, (IF, it turns out that we can develop meaningful immunity and reach herd immunity), however, we have a long ways to go before that data is in.
If you read up on Sweden's laissez-faire approach of allowing citizens to social distance on their own, with a good sampling of the different positions on Sweden's approach, you'll likely change your current position. Sweden's deaths per capita have risen steadily from day one, and is now at to slightly over 500 deaths per million, and that's despite them having what I believe will turn out to be the much milder strain of Covid-19. Take a look at the bordering countries and see how drastically higher Sweden's death rate is. I mean, it's PHENOMENALLY higher, and the researchers of your linked article were'n't bright enough to even use their immediate neighbors in the comparison. Had Sweden been hit with the virulent strain, the same one that ravaged NYC/NJ, Italy and Spain, their death rate might be close to double or higher, what it is now.
The authors of that tweet/post really baked the results. They only compared Sweden with the two of the worse, hardest hit countries in Europe, and the worse two cities in the U.S., (while leaving out Sweden's immediate neighbors for an apples to apples comparison), without knowing to factor in the consideration that those 4 areas were likely dealing with a MUCH more virulent strain of C19. It's just shameful to put out such shoddy work. It's tantamount to an outright lie. It's equal bad that @aler, @Jim in Scranton, @BruceGOATPearl threw their weight and approval behind such shoddy work. When we start baking results just to "win" a silly internet argument, we all lose. Fake, make-it-up news is NOT a good thing.
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No we wouldn’t. We can’t even get consensus on something as simple as wearing masks in public settings. We don’t have the stomach for such inconveniences.
There was an opportunity to stick it out a little longer, follow the now-pilloried “experts” and have real potential for a robust recovery. Now, we appear to be on track for some sort of economic purgatory for the foreseeable future and the results with be devastating.
You are correct that we will never know, but our results compared to others aren’t exactly promising.
I was not thrilled with Sweden;s response to begin with but I don't think anybody should be happy with how things are right now. The different strains are something a lot of us have said from the beginning and there is still a lot of push back on that. If we are right then there will be a "second wave" that will hit all of the uninfected in the fall with much more fatality because of the lack of antibodies.
The thing that we do know for real is the economic problem we will be facing as we move forward during the next strain of the virus in the fall. We have to figure out a way to fight the virus and still maintain some sort of stability in our economy. people are going to go to extremes on both sides because it is such an impact decision going down the road.
My comments have nothing to do with the "shut it down", or "crank it back up" debate. We CANNOT shelter-in-place and sit around until every economy crashes, and everyone starves to death.
I wasn't upset about the original plans to shelter-in-place primarily in order to avoid overrunning the medical system and to give us a bit more time to prepare, however, that is in ALL likelihood NOT the best solution in the long term, and going forward. The human race has weathered all kinds of diseases, even those that have ravaged, and even drastically reduced the human population. Faced with starving to death due to inactivity, or sitting in our homes for too long, I know which option I'd pick. Based on what we know at present, I feel we should get back to work/life, as long as we don't overrun the medical system. Even then, we may have no choice but to have bodies stacking up in the streets, as we cannot sit around and not produce food/goods for the world's population.
Then you should be able to stand up like a man, and easily offer a cogent argument that destroys the stupid things they are saying, right? I'm waiting to see your responses, (or at least, an intelligent explanation for falling for such a poor, deceitful article/tweet).
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Americans are selfich. Nothing more. Look a Japan New Zealand. Whole lot better than Sweden. Some countries cafe about the community and the people in it. US not so much.
It's not. If it were the flu it would be the flu but it's not so it's not.
I've never seen one of these "viruses" at all. Sounds like the Boogeyman and the tooth fairy to me.
I don't know why I'm laughing so hard at this right now
US is actually closer to sweden than SK or NZ btw. theres studies showing countries previously exposed to SARS experienced less deaths no matter what methods they used to counter covid......
I love to cafe, bro and i'm DEFINITELY not selfich.
South Korea has electronic tracking and government minders. No thanks. Why do lawyers constantly want to remove liberties? It’s strange.
This is likely good news, however, some of it could be due to the fact that most of those countries were better prepared. They had plans, they had equipment......, but most of all, I hope they had some level of immunity.
He understands the point. He just didn’t have the stomach to gut it out beyond his next hair appointment.
They also tested 6 weeks before us, contact traced, wire masks, etc. The USA blew it.
SARS killed about 700 people worldwide. SARS has very little to do with it except their preparation. Those countries were prepared.
Jesus Christ. You just don’t get it. The DOW crashed because of Covid 19, not the shutdown. The economy crashed as well. The economy would’ve suffered long term and short term more if we just went about our business. Why do you think the recovery is so slow? We aren’t shut down. Where is the V recovery? There isn’t one because Covid 19 is still here. I’m amazed that anybody thinks the economy will take until 2024 to recovery due to a 45 day shutdown.
IMO, America would have fully participated in a complete lock-down for a short period of time, like NZ did. Americans always show up when there is a clear mission. Three weeks of locking everything down, and this thing is behind us.
Many of us wanted to take a serious approach, with a shared sacrifice.
Instead, we got illogical, half-assed measures that let big-box stores print money while half the country was going out of business. Americans never show up when they smell a big ol pile of bullshit. And bullshit is all we've gotten from TPTB.
https://www.businessinsider.com/coronavirus-hopes-fade-for-swedens-herd-immunity-experiment-2020-6
Sweden's soft approach to the coronavirus has resulted in only a small portion of the population developing antibodies to the virus. This means the country appears highly unlikely to tackle the virus by achieving herd immunity.
Sweden's coronavirus death toll surpassed 5,000 this week, meaning its mortality rate per capita is very significantly higher than its neighboring Scandinavian countries as well as one of the highest in the world.
Lol. America is full of spoiled little bitches who make everything political. If you think they didn’t lockdown because big box stores stayed open then I can’t help you. What a ridiculous take. We can’t even get most people wearing masks. We are soft as jello.
Only behind UK Italy Belgium and Spain. These countries mostly ignored Covid 19 early on as well. See my stats above on Sweden’s three immediate neighbors.
On second thought, this is an obvious troll thread. You can't be that stupid and also a CPA.
Still, it feels a little malicious of you to post this, given that we've had a few members recently post about parents who've either died or are dying because of COVID. I wish I could say that "you're better than this," but I honestly don't have any evidence to support that.
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It's because we don't demand better from our elected leaders.
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