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Double Standard

I think my overall point is that we weren't just gonna hand out a scholarship to anyone this year to have a true backup PG. I think we know, and Pearl does too, it's all about next year.
While there's some truth to this, we also missed on some major impact transfers that we recruited really hard to backup Cooper.
 
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Agree with what you are saying program-wise but not so much about last night. We kept lobbing the ball sideways out of the double team with 3 guys standing and watching and ultimately ending up with SC going 1 on 3 or 4 trying to create off the dribble. Flash someone to the FT line and attack downhill with the number advantage. Have the bigs screen down for a shooter to pop up. Something. You can’t tell me AF who is supposedly a R1 pro prospect can’t do that.

I agree. I think we are going to definitely see adjustments made to what Arkansas did to Coop last night.

I think the Flanigan hype is a little overblown at this point even though I love his potential and how much better he's gotten since last year. Taking the ball from 30-feet and making a play just isn't his game. He make a plays one trip, and then the next commits a turnover. I think we are just missing that secondary guard on the floor who can attack and make an advantage play when Coop is doubled. That is going to be Powell and Alexander next year. The rest of the guys (Thor, Williams, Cambridge, etc.) need to be set up to make a play at this stage.
 
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Reflecting on last nights basketball game. On the road, up 17 points playing lock down defense. & we blew it. It is obvious we only have one PG on the roster and that is unacceptable. Much like our tackle position in football which gets roasted all the time. I love Bruce Pearl and hope he stays forever, but we do hold him and the basketball team to a different standard than football. Had that been a football game last night whoever the coach was you all would be going for his head right now.

WDE
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That’s fair. Personally I’d rather sign a mid-major caliber PG over another forward of center, but apples and oranges.

I would agree. I was actually on the don't sign Cardwell train, and save scholarship for another guard...which looks dumb now since Cardwell is a pretty good piece, especially for a true frosh. If Franklin leaves, I would bet 100% we sign best PG we can get next year.

If Franklin doesn't leave Powell and Alexander can both spell Cooper at PG, while the other plays the other guard spot (and Jamal playing some too).....we'd be more than fine doing that just couldn't afford a bad injury.
 
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I am not surprised that someone with Gus as their profile picture made this post. We have a lot of football fans who try to create basketball to football analogies on a regular basis and they almost never work. Being up early in basketball is not the same as it is in football because scores are much easier to come by. We led by 12(?) at the half and lost by 2 on the road. It's virtually impossible to account for leads in basketball. Was one team getting good looks but missing them? Did one team make more tough shots? Last night we had a great gameplan to attack them and got off to a good start, but they came up with a defense that causes us problems. Our answer to that defense was actually good, but often times we had young players making mistakes. We were typically one pass away from a wide open look (or dunk), but our young players forced bad shots. We lost all 5 starters from last year, which isn't that crazy in basketball but could you imagine losing all 22+ starters in football?

You can criticize Bruce for not grabbing another PG if you want, though I personally understand how the roster got in this situation. I think he thought he could make Turbo a serviceable backup PG. He was recruited as a shooting guard, but if he wanted any chance to continue his career he needed to become at least a combo guard. Turbo's handles were good enough, his athleticism was good enough, but for whatever reason he just didn't have what it took to be a PG at this level. Obviously had that plan worked out, Powell would have been a perfectly fine option as an emergency PG. Bruce clearly like to have combo guards, if you remember we would even let Harper run the 2 sometimes. Roster limitations keep you from being able to be stocked beyond emergencies at every position.

At the end of the day if you consider what this team's record would be if we had Sharife all season, then I think it becomes pretty obvious that Bruce did a great job building a roster that would continue to compete for championships. We would absolutely be in the running for winning the SEC this season, and we have a great chance at putting together an outstanding season next year that competes for everything.
 
I agree. I think we are going to definitely see adjustments made to what Arkansas did to Coop last night.

I think the Flanigan hype is a little overblown at this point even though I love his potential and how much better he's gotten since last year. Taking the ball from 30-feet and making a play just isn't his game. He make a plays one trip, and then the next commits a turnover. I think we are just missing that secondary guard on the floor who can attack and make an advantage play when Coop is doubled. That is going to be Powell and Alexander next year. The rest of the guys (Thor, Williams, Cambridge, etc.) need to be set up to make a play at this stage.
Agree about AF. Great body and work ethic and willing defender but needs a good bit of refinement on offensive skills. Needs to learn to dribble with his head up and use his off hand better. But I still think he is effective and a dribble drive option from 14 feet and in. We have been running the action we ran for Okoro, Samir and sometimes Chuma for him involving a curl off a screen at the elbow trying to get him going downhill with an angle to his left and it has worked pretty well at times when he doesn’t totally drop his head and drive into traffic or draw a charge. I kept waiting for us to flash him up to the FT line last night once to double got to SC so he could’ve attacked downhill with a big available on the block and a shooter in the ball side corner but I never materialized. We kept playing slow and throwing the ball sideways.
 
Agree about AF. Great body and work ethic and willing defender but needs a good bit of refinement on offensive skills. Needs to learn to dribble with his head up and use his off hand better. But I still think he is effective and a dribble drive option from 14 feet and in. We have been running the action we ran for Okoro, Samir and sometimes Chuma for him involving a curl off a screen at the elbow trying to get him going downhill with an angle to his left and it has worked pretty well at times when he doesn’t totally drop his head and drive into traffic or draw a charge. I kept waiting for us to flash him up to the FT line last night once to double got to SC so he could’ve attacked downhill with a big available on the block and a shooter in the ball side corner but I never materialized. We kept playing slow and throwing the ball sideways.

We probably gonna see this moving forward. Also with Flanigan in foul trouble we may have not wanted to risk him committing a charge for his 5th by setting up something for him downhill. I think we we trying to give the ball up early and run Cooper off the ball hoping they'd back off the double deeper into our half-court set. Pearl ain't gonna let that give us fits for much longer.
 
Some of these basketball takes are embarassing.
Which ones?

Who runs point next year if Coop leaves?
It's incredibility difficult to manage a basketball roster with no holes for 3-4 straight years in the 1-and-done era.
Now add the NCAA/FBI thing that basically left us without a recruiting class for a year....and it's near impossible. It's why we had to do a mini rebuild, are extremely young, and have some holes.

Everyone is getting so hung up on a "true back up PG." Basketball isn't like that anymore. A lot of teams have 1 true PG, and then spell him with guards who can handle and make plays. If you have a 5-star PG that's gonna play 30-35 minutes a game....a true PG behind him playing 5-10 minutes a game is gonna transfer (Davion) or not be any good. McCormick was the exception. Those guys don't grow on trees.

Powell is that guard for us that can give us quality "PG" minutes behind Cooper, even if he's a "SG"....but everyone is getting too hung up on the traditional 5 basketball positions that aren't as relevant anymore. He's hurt.

We also don't have scholarships to just hand out to anyone. To add another PG next year, someone has to leave. We could have gone after a few second-tier transfer PGs after we missed on some bigger names, but we didn't. I think Pearl wanted to see what he had this year in a rebuild, and then address this offseason. I think that's acceptable.

To compare it to years of poor OT recruiting, when literally any 4-star player could come in and start at LT immediately is not a fair comparison.
Dude... we have 2 options to play the pg position. That is including a guy that is a "combo guard". Flanigan is not a guy that we should have to rely on to run the point. So having 2 total guys on a roster that are capable of running the show is not normal. Tell yourself that all that you want, but point out another SEC program with the same issue?

So what is the plan if Sharife leaves? Who is running the show? Powell? Who else?
 
Reflecting on last nights basketball game. On the road, up 17 points playing lock down defense. & we blew it. It is obvious we only have one PG on the roster and that is unacceptable. Much like our tackle position in football which gets roasted all the time. I love Bruce Pearl and hope he stays forever, but we do hold him and the basketball team to a different standard than football. Had that been a football game last night whoever the coach was you all would be going for his head right now.

WDE

This doesn't even warrant a response really, but I can't help myself...

Is this a joke? The fact that you morons continuously try to compare the football situation to basketball is beyond ridiculous. First of all, over the past few years Bruce has had a "true" PG transfer (to Baylor..the #2 team in the country right now), one leave earlier than expected, AND another one that decided to transfer midseason (this year). Second, Bruce has literally had to dig our bball program out of the ashes and build it from scratch. Now, compare that to the tradition and history rich football program (you can't). Finally, due to all of these early departures and having to build it from scratch, we have one of the youngest teams in the entire country.

The only thing that is "unacceptable" at the moment is the fact that you even posted this bs.
 
Which ones?

Who runs point next year if Coop leaves?

Dude... we have 2 options to play the pg position. That is including a guy that is a "combo guard". Flanigan is not a guy that we should have to rely on to run the point. So having 2 total guys on a roster that are capable of running the show is not normal. Tell yourself that all that you want, but point out another SEC program with the same issue?

So what is the plan if Sharife leaves? Who is running the show? Powell? Who else?
We sign a PG cause we would have a spot open. Its a rebuilding and development year. Relax.
 
Which ones?

Who runs point next year if Coop leaves?

Dude... we have 2 options to play the pg position. That is including a guy that is a "combo guard". Flanigan is not a guy that we should have to rely on to run the point. So having 2 total guys on a roster that are capable of running the show is not normal. Tell yourself that all that you want, but point out another SEC program with the same issue?

So what is the plan if Sharife leaves? Who is running the show? Powell? Who else?
Davion left, Turbo wasn't good enough, Justin is concussed and Sharife is a Freshman All-American.

Seems like Bruce Pearl is doing a fine job recruiting.
 
A few thoughts ...

Double standard?

Gus ... had some highs and had some lows ... things were trending down. Paid to be a top coach. Wasn't performing like a top coach.

Bruce ... the best thing that has ever happened to Auburn basketball -- historically one of the bottom 2 or 3 programs in the SEC and one of the weakest P5 programs.

If there's a double standard, I'm absolutely fine with it.

Lotta yap about the PG guard position. Three peculiar circumstances have occurred -- Davion leaves because he thinks he's stuck in a reserve role for two years instead of one (Bruce improvised with J'Von), Sharife/NCAA, and JP's concussion. You're not going to hit with every single recruit, so that explains Turbo.

But laying it aside football is silliness. Bottom line, a basketball vs. football comparison is like comparing apples and washing machines.

In-game coaching is different, recruiting is different.

In football, we're hoping we're heading in a good direction with a coaching change and we certainly didn't have that hope with Gus. In basketball, you can see that we are heading in a potentially special direction. Just have a shred of patience to wait for it and not lose your Cheeze-Its.
 
Reflecting on last nights basketball game. On the road, up 17 points playing lock down defense. & we blew it. It is obvious we only have one PG on the roster and that is unacceptable. Much like our tackle position in football which gets roasted all the time. I love Bruce Pearl and hope he stays forever, but we do hold him and the basketball team to a different standard than football. Had that been a football game last night whoever the coach was you all would be going for his head right now.

WDE

You have a lot more scholarships on a football roster to have a position covered than you do in basketball. Basketball gets, what, 9 or 10 scholarship slots? In other words, there's no such thing as a "four deep" roster at a given position. You might have two true PGs. Or you have a PG and a combo guard to spell him. Football also doesn't have to concern itself with losing players to the draft after one year, or having key prospects decide to go play in the 'minors.' Truth is, we had this set up nicely with Jared followed by Davion Mitchell, followed by Turbo and Sharife.

We didn't expect Davion to bail and Jared to leave early. Nor could we have expected the NCAA to screw Sharife over for 11 games and Powell to be out 4 games with a concussion. About the only thing I can fault Pearl for here is the eval on Turbo.
 
It's almost like he has won 25+ games 3 seasons in a row, 2 SEC titles, gotten us to the final 4 with the worst program in the P5....and then the roster completely turned over and he has earned a rebuild year with the youngest team in the country.
not to mention our backup PG(would be playing lots) that should still be on the roster transferred and is starting for the 2nd best team in the country. Oh yea and the other guard we thought could play a little was abysmal
 
Davion left, Turbo wasn't good enough, Justin is concussed and Sharife is a Freshman All-American.

Seems like Bruce Pearl is doing a fine job recruiting.
If Davion is here, Cooper isn’t. It’s that simple. He’s be a senior. Or he’d have left early and we’d have Cooper, we wouldn’t have them both. Turbo and Powell are both Combo Guards who can moonlight at Point. Turbo couldn’t do it and I think Powell can (in small segments). It was clear last December that Turbo couldn’t play point and thus we played Samir who wasn’t a point and struggled mightily early on. It’s more than fair to point out the need for another guard, particularly a point guard. I think you could argue roster wise it’s really the only weak spot for the last 4 years.

The obvious answer is that Bruce simply values a high ranked wing/forward more than a mid-tier PG. We could certainly
sign another, but he’s rather use that scholarship on someone else. I’m ok with that assuming Powell pans out, but we’re injury or draft declaration away from being in a precarious spot for next year.
 
not to mention our backup PG(would be playing lots) that should still be on the roster transferred and is starting for the 2nd best team in the country. Oh yea and the other guard we thought could play a little was abysmal
You really think Cooper would have come here with Davion coming back for his Senior year? Not happening.
 
We sign a PG cause we would have a spot open. Its a rebuilding and development year. Relax.
So if this is the case... and Sharife leaves, we are relying on one new guy at the PG position. Either a freshman or a transfer. And then would have the same options as a backup again.

I trust that we will be fine, but we have seen this year what the team looks like without a true PG. So not having more than ONE on roster seems odd.
 
Davion left, Turbo wasn't good enough, Justin is concussed and Sharife is a Freshman All-American.

Seems like Bruce Pearl is doing a fine job recruiting.
That is 2 potential guys on the roster that can play point. Both of which are true freshman, and one of which is likely to leave after this year... leaving us in the same boat next year with the option of either signing a freshman to play the point or getting a transfer.

No one is bashing Bruce's recruiting. He is one of the absolute best in the business. Period. Our roster is absolutely loaded with talent. Just a bit unbalanced at the moment.

Davion transferred years ago. We've known for a while that Turbo wasn't going to pan out. That leaves the two true freshman. It would be beneficial for the team to have more than just those two options. It is weird that this is a contentious thing to point out. They literally talk about it in every broadcast. And we saw what we looked like without a PG prior to Sharife getting cleared.
 
I thought Cooper was coming here regardless due to his connections with Strech and Okoro( I know I'm missing one other former HS teammate too, name escapes me)?
I mean I’d love that, but I can’t see him coming in to play with a seasoned stater? Maybe Davion would have been ok with sliding over, but I think the overall point remains.
 
That is 2 potential guys on the roster that can play point. Both of which are true freshman, and one of which is likely to leave after this year... leaving us in the same boat next year with the option of either signing a freshman to play the point or getting a transfer.

No one is bashing Bruce's recruiting. He is one of the absolute best in the business. Period. Our roster is absolutely loaded with talent. Just a bit unbalanced at the moment.

Davion transferred years ago. We've known for a while that Turbo wasn't going to pan out. That leaves the two true freshman. It would be beneficial for the team to have more than just those two options. It is weird that this is a contentious thing to point out. They literally talk about it in every broadcast. And we saw what we looked like without a PG prior to Sharife getting cleared.
Kentucky won 31 games in 2009-10, lost in the regional final.

Their point guard was John Wall.

Their backup point guard? A 6-1 shooting guard named Eric Bledsoe.

What was the plan had Wall not qualified or gotten hurt? There wasn't a plan.

This is life.
 
Kentucky won 31 games in 2009-10, lost in the regional final.

Their point guard was John Wall.

Their backup point guard? A 6-1 shooting guard named Eric Bledsoe.

What was the plan had Wall not qualified or gotten hurt? There wasn't a plan.

This is life.
That’s 2 current NBA point guards... what’s your point? Now Bledsoe took a bit longer to develop, but he had true PG skills. They would have been fine. Not sure I see the comp to Powell or Turbo and what will happen to us if Cooper gets hurt.
 
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That’s 2 current NBA point guards... what’s your point? Now Bledsoe took a bit longer to develop, but he had true PG skills. They would have been fine. Not sure I see the comp to Powell or Turbo and what will happen to us if Cooper gets hurt.
Bledsoe is a combo guard, similar to Justin Powell in role while at Kentucky.

He did not, and does not, have "true point guard skills."
 
I definitely think it would benefit this team to have Franklin move on, and sign a PG in the offseason.

However, odds are he ain't gonna be better than Powell at running Point, so he might not even see the floor with the team at full strength. We'd simply rotate Powell to PG and bring in Alexander/Johnson when Sharife needs rest. Alexander can handle and create as well.

Which means that PG simply gonna be on the bench as an insurance policy in case of injury. Good luck finding a serviceable transfer willing to do that. You could go the freshman route, but it's gonna be a 3-star guy who will take up a scholarship for 4 years, and may never pan out.
 
LOL at anyone who thinks Eric Bledsoe is a true PG. Dude is a damn bulldog that happens to be athletic.
 
That’s 2 current NBA point guards... what’s your point? Now Bledsoe took a bit longer to develop, but he had true PG skills. They would have been fine. Not sure I see the comp to Powell or Turbo and what will happen to us if Cooper gets hurt.

We act like Powell wasn't playing well as full-time PG before injury for a true frosh. He is more than capable of giving you 10 really good minutes a game at PG. Alexander has the skill set to do this as well next year.
 
Reflecting on last nights basketball game. On the road, up 17 points playing lock down defense. & we blew it. It is obvious we only have one PG on the roster and that is unacceptable. Much like our tackle position in football which gets roasted all the time. I love Bruce Pearl and hope he stays forever, but we do hold him and the basketball team to a different standard than football. Had that been a football game last night whoever the coach was you all would be going for his head right now.

WDE
True
 
I would agree. I was actually on the don't sign Cardwell train, and save scholarship for another guard...which looks dumb now since Cardwell is a pretty good piece, especially for a true frosh. If Franklin leaves, I would bet 100% we sign best PG we can get next year.

If Franklin doesn't leave Powell and Alexander can both spell Cooper at PG, while the other plays the other guard spot (and Jamal playing some too).....we'd be more than fine doing that just couldn't afford a bad injury.
FRANKLIN may end up beeeing PERTY DAYUM GOOOD!!!!
Heeeeez got sum goood SKEEEEEEEELZ!!
 
FRANKLIN may end up beeeing PERTY DAYUM GOOOD!!!!
Heeeeez got sum goood SKEEEEEEEELZ!!

His two 3s kept us in the game last night when Arky was scoring every trip. He's done some impactful things when in the game. With Smith coming in next year and everyone else continuing to develop (Thor, Cardwell, Jaylin, etc) not sure I see much opportunity for him to get minutes.
 
Reflecting on last nights basketball game. On the road, up 17 points playing lock down defense. & we blew it. It is obvious we only have one PG on the roster and that is unacceptable. Much like our tackle position in football which gets roasted all the time. I love Bruce Pearl and hope he stays forever, but we do hold him and the basketball team to a different standard than football. Had that been a football game last night whoever the coach was you all would be going for his head right now.

WDE
Umm, No one would be down CGM throats like they were if he didn't give the same mundane answers ever press conference and simply say. My play calling was bad. My game-plan for them was bad. I screwed up that play call. We should have used "insert name here" more.

So when you have success like we do that we never have had, plus a Coach who is willing to say I screwed up, and a coach who is saying the EXACT same thing the board said, well, it doesn't take a rocket science to understand why we aren't going for his head.....
 
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His two 3s kept us in the game last night when Arky was scoring every trip. He's done some impactful things when in the game. With Smith coming in next year and everyone else continuing to develop (Thor, Cardwell, Jaylin, etc) not sure I see much opportunity for him to get minutes.
Heeeez got sum upside. HE GOES TO THE RACK!!
Not shure wut hiz future holds but it lookz like he kood be a GOOOOD PLAYA.
 
Bledsoe is a combo guard, similar to Justin Powell in role while at Kentucky.
That UK team was one of the most talented teams I can ever recall. Cousins, Wall, Bledsoe and Patterson have all been long-time NBA starters and all-stars in a couple of their cases.

- he was more of a 2 than a PG, but he was listed as as PG coming out of high school.

They had 2 NBA starters in their backcourt. Both of which were more than capable of being a PG in the SEC. So they had options. They also had Liggins (who handled backup PG duties in that season and the next) and Darius Miller at the 2 for what seemed like a decade iirc.
We act like Powell wasn't playing well as full-time PG before injury for a true frosh. He is more than capable of giving you 10 really good minutes a game at PG. Alexander has the skill set to do this as well next year.
If you can't tell the difference a real PG makes (even if he is a superstar like Sharife) then I can't help you. Our offense was not anywhere near the top tier of the SEC standards without a real PG.

You haven't answered what happens at PG if Sharife leaves. You keep assuming he is back. If he is, then we are a top 10 team for the entirety of the season... if not higher imo. BUT... if he is not here, then we are not going to be able to reach our maximum potential without bringing in a PG from somewhere.
 
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That UK team was one of the most talented teams I can ever recall. Cousins, Wall, Bledsoe and Patterson have all been long-time NBA starters and all-stars in a couple of their cases.

- he was more of a 2 than a PG, but he was listed as as PG coming out of high school.

They had 2 NBA starters in their backcourt. Both of which were more than capable of being a PG in the SEC. So they had options. They also had Liggins (who handled backup PG duties in that season and the next) and Darius Miller at the 2 for what seemed like a decade iirc.

If you can't tell the difference a real PG makes (even if he is a superstar like Sharife) then I can't help you. Our offense was not anywhere near the top tier of the SEC standards without a real PG.

Difference in asking Powell to be full-time PG, and asking him to give you 10 minutes at PG a game. Like I said, if we can sign a true backup PG I'm all for it, but how many guys that would be serviceable willing to come do that? Good chance Powell still beating them out to run Point when Sharife goes to the bench. They might not even play at all. Just would be an emergency insurance policy.
 
Difference in asking Powell to be full-time PG, and asking him to give you 10 minutes at PG a game. Like I said, if we can sign a true backup PG I'm all for it, but how many guys that would be serviceable willing to come do that? Good chance Powell still beating them out to run Point when Sharife goes to the bench. They might not even play at all. Just would be an emergency insurance policy.
So I will ask one more time... since for some reason you always ignore this part: What happens if Sharife doesn't come back for next year??? Justin Powell would be forced into an on-ball roll that is not ideal for him or our team. Either that, or we will be relying on one newcomer to be the primary facilitator/ball-handler. Right?
 
So I will ask one more time... since for some reason you always ignore this part: What happens if Sharife doesn't come back for next year??? Justin Powell would be forced into an on-ball roll that is not ideal for him or our team. Either that, or we will be relying on one newcomer to be the primary facilitator/ball-handler. Right?
I will answer for him. Yes
 
So I will ask one more time... since for some reason you always ignore this part: What happens if Sharife doesn't come back for next year??? Justin Powell would be forced into an on-ball roll that is not ideal for him or our team. Either that, or we will be relying on one newcomer to be the primary facilitator/ball-handler. Right?

The hope is we get Scoot to reclassify if Sharife leaves. No. 13 overall player in the country for the 2022 class. We may push harder to sign a true backup for him, since he would be an unproven reclass...though extremely talented.

If Coop leaves I don't think there's any chance we make Powell full-time and only PG.
 
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